Oh, you knew I was going to break the promise

Post itself too boring to Watch but a miniWatch from the commentariat.

xyzzy sez:

It’s certainly noticeable that a mural containing the names of all thirty children in a primary school class (a CofE church school) in a city centre carpark contains about twenty six given names that scream `poor ill-educated black’. What is it about the black community that forces made-up names on their children? Isn’t it just doing the racists work for them before interview?

I wept a little for HP’s antiracist credentials as I read this. Though I believed they’d reached broken cornflakes at bottom of packet level, there were a few crumbs left, I had hoped (o the folly of hope!).*

* All names are made up, xyzzy, you utter twat**. My name is made up. Your name is made up. THIS BEING THE NATURE OF WORDS, WHICH ARE ALL MADE UP.

**OMG, they let the darkies into a Church of England school? I’m not sure I will ever recover from the sheer horrorism. And they were poor too? Pass me a bucket, I’m going to vomit.

A return to form

Oh dear, HP! And I thought you were playing so nicely!

The comrades at Hitchens Watch rightly point out that I laugh at the commenters more than the posts. My defence for this was that nearly all the posts are David T calling everything from grandmothers to apple pie antisemitic, so all my posts would basically be made up of “WHAT ARE YOU MAD NO SERIOUSLY”. Then I realised that’s what I do anyway so I’d better suck it up and concentrate on akshul post.

Today chums, we are doing Harry’s Place take on the Embra International Film Festival refusing funding from the Israeli government. I’m sure that everyone has guessed that this was ANTISEMITIC (though HP seem to have forgotten the same thing happened in 2006, which is weird as they’d almost certainly reported on it at the time, but I can’t be arsed to check.) gene is linking to a previous post which may or may not be more interesting, but I’ll do that a bit later.

Anyway, our bold tosspot also links to a very silly article in the Independent by one Gary Sinyor. Naturally the commenters give it rave reviews and have their tongues hanging out even further at his “bravery” when they discover he’s Jewish, but we’re not doing commenters today (bah, you all know I’m going to break this promise!). Displaying the usual respect for facts and truth and shit we’ve grown to love from HP, gene has chosen a badly written piece of nonsense to make his point. No change there then.

Mr Sinyor has chosen to protest the 2009 handing back of the dosh by handing back an award he won off them in 1992. No, I don’t know why he waited till 2009 when the same match was played in 2006 to the same result. Back in the day people were pissed off about Lebanon, now they are pissed off about the massacre in Gaza. S’funny how Israel keeps pissing people off, but outwith scope of this blog. He goes on to say:

There doesn’t seem to be any dispute about what happened next. A Palestinian campaign group called Socialist Unity launched a campaign to have the money returned – or else it would boycott the whole festival.

Well, I’d dispute that, on the grounds it didn’t happen. Socialist Unity is about as much a Palestinian campaign group as I am an Albanian goat herder. It is, rather, a site run by a Stalinist for the purpose of rerunning endless battles between tiny Trot sects. You’d think with HP’s fixation on the minutiae of Trot sectariana, they would know this.

He means the SPSC, which I am unable to link to as their site is down, but if you’re going to return a lump of metal in the manner of a sulky teenager breaking up with her boyfriend of two weeks, it’s at least advisable to learn who your rival is.

Furthermore:

EIFF managing director Ginnie Atkinson told them where to get off in a strong and coherent statement (according to The Scotsman) in which she said not accepting support from one particular country “would set a dangerous precedent by politicising a cultural and artistic mission”.So far, so much agreement.

This is what I mean about badly written. Who’s agreeing with who here? Is the SPSC agreeing with Ms Atkinson? Are the readers agreeing with Mr Sinyor? Are the Palestinian campaign groups agreeing with the readers? (Indeed, are the Palestinian campaign groups even Palestinian? Andy Newman’s from the southwest of England IIRC and I think Mick Napier’s Glaswegian originally.) Is the editor agreeing with Mr Sinyor? Is a mouse in his pocket agreeing with the voices in his head? Is everyone dancing about in a meadow rubbing each others’ cocks?

We can only assume, therefore, that Ken Loach exerted sufficient pressure on the festival that one of the most prestigious film festivals in the world actually caved in.

The “Palestinian campaign group” having magically vanished, then. For the edification of the reader, I shall tell you what actually happened, because the game remains the same. The EIFF started off as “aw bollocks it’s the SPSC again, well if it’s just them we can keep the dough but if anyone else gets interested, we’ll have to reconsider.” Other people got interested. They reconsidered. They’re blaming Ken Loach in order to make their U turn sound like it was because the nasty man picked on them.

In linking this poorly shoved together tripe as the “best summary evaaaa” HP with their usual stunning “antiracist” stance manage to defend taking money from a state with openly racist policies and blame everything on the wicked lefties at the same time. They also display a complete lack of understanding of how lobbying and boycotts work, which isn’t surprising because most of their bold work against antisemitism revolves around posting at t’Place defending Israeli soldiers who shoot unarmed protestors in the chest.

Terrifyingly and on a personal note, the last word on this matter shall go to John Wight (I promise I will never do this again.)

I would hope that the filmmaker in question, as a self declared member of the Israeli peace movement, would welcome such a campaign, thereby joining the ranks of those heroic white South Africans who stood in solidarity with their black brothers and sisters against their own government when apartheid in South Africa reduced the lives of millions to a living hell.

 

 

Hey nonexistent readers!

Where have I been? In A&E, that’s where, after some arm related fuckery and general tomfoolery required the aid of three nurses, seven doctors, four funny looking machines and copious amounts of bandaging. Yes, I am typing this one handed, and not for the usual reasons either.

In the meanwhile HP hasn’t been fielding their A team when it comes to wingnuttery. We have a post from Gene which hpwatch actually applauds for its stance. Comrades, you may not see its like again, so watch and marvel while you may (and before the revolution, in which all HP posters and contributors will be shot only joking).  The comments box is like the proverbial muffin with dogshit included, but that’s not new for HP so it’s not really Watchable.

Hope not Hate do their antifascist thing. All very nice. OK, it’s not antifa who are a fuck of a lot more likely to bring the lulz and break heads where such is needed, but then who is? Comments box shows the more likeable side of a couple of regs who hpwatch tends to look on with disapproval. Miniwatch for some slight evidence of madness from anaxiwhatever:

I do suspect one thing though, that you, yes you, would have found a very ‘good’ reason not to fight, wouldn’t you, yes of course you would, people like you always do.

Leaving aside the obvious political issues with this (and that it’s utter wank, which goes without saying) it reminds me of the argument I had with some daft cow once when I was going into a StWC meeting. “You would have got a white feather in World War 1! You’re too much of  a coward to join up!” she howled. I was left dumbfounded, as not even the military recruiters who hang around the Jobcentre in the desperate broke small town I come from would ever say “Hmm, an extremely short woman wearing a jacket covered in lefty badges while walking into a Stop The War Coalition meeting, my ideal recruit! Let me sign her up right away!”

The rest is par for the course. If you carry on like this, HP, I may have to stop Watching. (Yes I know there are dodgier posts further down but if it’s not recent enough for me I don’t the Watching, cdes. Contrary to popular expectations, I do have a life.)

To make up for everything, including the tedium of this post, here’s a flying talking chattering bee.

halo thar

Oh you di’nt

Fascists riot. HP’s position? Qualified support.

I really think Harry would have disapproved of that. It might be wishful thinking, though.

How do they have any claim to the moral high ground when their commenters react to the beating of Asians by men in balaclavas and England shirts with the rough equivalent of “Well, the Muslims have been getting a bit uppity recently”? Or as old peculier says:

However, these riots are completely expected when people get angry. And it is understandable that the people of Luton are angry.

Or as swan put it:

I’m impressed and pleased that at last some people are standing up…I’m not totally against them attacking certain individuals, but doing it in the context of an angry mod targeting the first brown face right in a public place in broad daylight does you no good. They need to show a little discipline.

Yes, swan. First carefully select your brown face to be beaten in, and then proceed. In a disciplined fashion, of course.

This is what I don’t get about that site and I’m a bit too angry for jokes right now so I’ll just go ahead with it. How can these mad bastards not realise that what they’re posting, the culture of their site, is attracting fash like shit attracts flies? How can someone read the nonsense that David T posts where the free world and all Jews everywhere are in mortal danger from the SWP’s Central Committee and their wicked plans, then see a picture like this:

and think “Just nice British boys out for a stroll and you can’t blame them really, as Muslims can be rather aggravating, always complaining about nothing”? Do they not think it’s theoretically possible that Muslims have more to worry about from racist thugs whose party is on the rise in Britain than Jews have to worry about from John Rees being a little bit stern about Israel?

old peculier goes on to sneer:

Another thing – why are balaclavas considered a bad thing, when burkhas are multi-culti hunky dory? At least those men freely chose to wear them rather than being forced to on pain of honour killing.

Which may actually be the most fucking stupid clothing related argument ever, and there is a point here. I have freely chosen to cover my face on a demo before (tho less for tactical reasons than because it was bloody cold.) But there are generally two reasons it’s done. You do it to hide your identity and you do it to intimidate. And that’s what they were doing, whereas women in burkhas are just wearing a fucking burkha. The context of the demo provides the context of the action.

The boys in the pic wanted to scare Asians and that is why they are dressed as they are. You’d either have to be the biggest numpty in the world or pathologically disingenuous not to see that.

To sum this crazy shit up, this is the BNP out of uniform as one of the sprinkling of sane commentators said. This is the fascist. This is your enemy. But instead HP turn the big guns on the mild mannered Trot paper seller, that dastardly threat to the world, while letting their comment boxes be overrun with racist cunts. They do this while calling themselves an antifascist and antiracist “lefty” website. I don’t understand.*

*I’m also too pissed off for petty point scoring so I wish to express my respect for the handful of regulars who didn’t act like complete tools. The two Stans, standing and stangroom came out of this half decently, you may be Decents who I’d disagree with about almost everything being as how I’m a Trot** and therefore a mass murderer or something but you’re right that the fash are scum. morgoth, again we would agree on practically nothing but I apologise for referring to you as a cunt as you behaved in a completely uncuntish fashion on that thread (so far).  Anyway none of you will ever read this, but I thought I’d get it off my chest.

**I expect the reader (if I have one) never would have guessed. In the interests of full disclosure I had a pint with a member of the Socialist Workers Party last Thursday.

If I die before my parents die…

Housekeeping. Yes, I do have a job and a life.

All the blogs on my blogroll are excellent and you should go there (with the exception of HP, which you should flee from while squealing in confusion. I do the Watching so you don’t have to.) They contain at least 100 percent more erudition and big words and politics and Arsenal and Marxism and things and at least 99 percent less swearing than this humble bloglet. I do try not to but it just pops out, innit.

I was amused to be asked to rate my gravatar thingey from G to X on how child friendly it was. I decided to make Comrade Dzerzhinsky a G which may be a controversial decision, but he was rather child friendly. It was just counterrevolutionaries he didn’t like. 😉

Can’t really be bothered Watching the thing about Israel which will be as ridiculous and cockeyed as all HP posts on the subject are, if the Israeli government announced that all Palestinians will be tied up and subjected to forcible bukkake then undoubtedly the massed ranks of HP would manage to defend that as a totally necessary action. Slightly more intrigued by Dorries but it’s old news…I’m always running to catch up with HP postings anyway.

However the comment box has a couple of gems and an intriguing side discussion about the McCanns (remind me to tell you my Maddie joke sometime, it was shared with me by a disgruntled anarchist. No, it is not very nice, but let’s face it we all know what happened there) so I’ll do a speshul mini Watch on those.

field and shatterface get it on over Maddie. field is of the opinion that dodgy deeds have been done over the whole affair. shatterface comes from the school of thought which says “dead kiddie stops play” and basically accuses field of being a paedo with this wonderful rant:

And I don’t want the constitution of my country dictated by hate-filled vigilantes who don’t think the loss of a daughter is enough punishment for parents who were just stupid in leaving their kid alone.

Profilers are familiar enough with sickos trying to insinuate themselves into investigations: someone should take a look at your fucking hard-drive.

Boys, boys! That was really a bit nasty. Well, when I say a bit, I mean “fucking seriously nasty”. I may now and again poke fun but accusations of kiddie-porn watching should really be thought about carefully and then only made for teh lulz.

Luckily kbplayer is the voice of reason as he/she/it (I’m going to start aligning genders randomly or withdrawing them at will. Just like God!) points out that anyone who describes themselves as a cheeky scouser at heart should be banned completely from the internet. He left out “and then be shot” but maybe he was typing in a hurry.

As usual bizarre claims were made, my favourite being cipriano‘s:

this is a lefty website after all.

If anyone can tell me in what way, shape or form Harry’s Place could claim to be a “lefty website” I will personally buy them an ENTIRE FUCKING SHEEP. Even the poor benighted Stalinist who set it up has fled for saner climes.

Dancing round the maypole of sanity

O hai! I’m happy today cause the sun is out, the birds are doing their bird thing, and Harry’s Place says something sensible. Who knew that could even happen?

Exposing the nuts and fruitcakes who make up the BNP is done better (as so many things are) by the admirable Norfolk Unity and commentator barbara points out that their takedown of Red Squirrel was really much lulzier. But the comments box makes up for a rather tedious though good hearted post as morgoth appears to discuss the quite frankly mad nithing curse, which I shall reproduce below because it made me laugh.  

Yes, this is the sort of thing BNP members get up to in their spare time. I’m not sure which Mohammed is referred to here as there’s quite a number of them, but I’m going to hope it’s Mohammed from the sheriff officers, as he is fairly evil (only kidding Mohammed, please don’t come round and repossess my laptop). You’d think a curse would be a bit more specific but I can’t be arsed listening to it to see if the daft bint ever actually gets round to even allocating a second name. I also like the “fact” that the gods themselves have created this ritual. I’m so sure that’s how a god would spend their spare time, creating rituals for thick fash. Don’t they have some smiting to do?

morgoth truthfully and wisely points out that Odinists are generally knobs, but then red squirrel, appearing to defend herself as only the BNP can:

Fuck Off!

correctly points out that morgoth is, himself, a cunt. I would like it read into the record that his cuntishness, though it undeniably exists, is mitigated by him not being a fascist tree worshipping Hitler fellating piece of shit with a really dodgy hairdo. Really this is a battle I’d like to see both sides lose, but the Nutzis lose more painfully.

lee barnes brings his inimitable brand of madness to the debate as he comments:

Hi Dickheads,

You really should be aware that the online bullying of young girls by grown men is truly pitiful.

Sad, tragic little men still living with mummy and daddy or at university alone in their room typing spiteful shite on the internet.

Get a life you sad, tragic fucks.

Wankers.

Regards,

Lee

Now HP do have form in bullying young girls ont’ intraweb, but since Red Squirrel is neither young nor, indeed, a girl (she looks like one of the blokes in the Bounce advert) this is rather misguided target acquisition. Then again, we are talking about Lee Barnes, so I am strangely unsurprised. I also love the fact he lets out a torrent of abuse then finishes it with “Regards”. Cheers, old bean!

A mixed bag then but points go to standing for making an anti BNP post (more please) and all commentators for getting through an entire post and comments section without mentioning Israel and/or Trots. (Letting fabian off as it’s part of his nick.) Keep it up lads!

Say it, you fuckers!

I was at my union’s conference so no bloggin’ for a few days. And then I come back and the middle class (as represented by HP’s comments box) are revolting! (Insert obvious joke here.)

We need to talk about immigration apparently. Oh yes. We always need to talk about immigration at Harry’s Place. The two big I’s are immigration and Israel, and they managed to get both of those into a discussion on posties refusing to deliver fash leaflets, which I shall expand upon later. The happy occasion was a discussion between Lionel Shriver and some professor of some shit or other on the beastly immigrants and how you just can’t say what everyone’s thinking. This is probably the fault of the Muslims, as let’s face it everything else is.

Now you might have spotted the super lulzy issue here, which is that Ms Shriver herself is an immigrant condemning immigrants. She’s an American living in London. But I dunno, she’s not all foreign talking and brown and shit, she even wrote a book in English! So she is totally qualified to berate the British about our “immigration problem” though I note she didn’t offer to go back where she came from to reduce the pressure on housing etc. I present a small exerpt from the post but I don’t recommend reading it in its entirety, as the term tl;dr was pretty much invented for such situations.

With the Eastern Europeans, everyone was incredibly grateful to be talking about white Christians. Then we could really talk about immigration. How many of these people do we want in here? Aren’t they swelling our neighbourhoods, increasing the housing shortage? Aren’t they clinging to themselves and not assimilating? I go into a Polish grocery and they won’t serve me. There was that story recently. The point is, these immigrants weren’t Muslims and weren’t dark-skinned. So at last it was possible to talk about it.

So in other words the great contribution she’s making to the debate is recycled Daily Mail nonsense about the wicked immigrunts snubbing the honest American…sorry, indigenous inhabitants of the country. Cheers for that luv.

Anyway much wankery and “whole STREETS full of Brown People jabbering away in their darkie lingo” moaning later, we come to the comments box. O how I love the HP comments box. I do not know why they still kid on that they’re opposed to the BNP, as about half the comments wouldn’t look out of place on Stormfront.

Muslims are very nifty, and getting steadily more skilful and successful, at grabbing everything going and demanding all kinds of special favours.

Or perhaps:

FOOTNOTE: Sooner or later someone of importance is going to say the dreaded word ‘expulsion’ aloud. This year or next. Wait and see.

With a seasoning of:

I would also argue that the white working class BNP supporter has been abandoned and actively villified by the Western Left and Left intelligencia for the last 40 years. Whereas the Muslim immigrant has been actively advocated for, protected and supported by the same.

The BNP voter has a real gripe, the Muslims have been pandered too and have all sorts of special programs and preferences, diversity promotion, etc.

Or a side dish of:

Yeah, you give Muslims money and they’ll be like rich muslims. There are plenty of rich muslims among the oil fields of Saudi, and you can see that wonderful moderating influence… er no wait, what fucking nonsense.

With a drizzle of….nah fuck it, this is getting depressing:

I would, unfairly, not accept a Polish cleaning lady,as they are very aggressive. If you tell them you have given the job to someone else they put their foot into the doorway and fight. If you accept them they beg you not to employ them officially, then one day they will refuse to budge from the tea table.

But they’re being stifled! They can’t have the immigration debate because the eeeebil PC forces will crush their tender heads and steal their firstborns and there are things you Just Can’t Say because, because it’s not Politically Correct and something will happen to them and, and….

The awkward facts are not to said aloud by decent and goodthinkful people, such as Toynbees and similar Guardianistas

I’ve never got this argument because in my experience there’s really very little stopping you from being as much of a racist cunt as you like. You can’t howl “nigger” at a black person in the street, but the denizens of HP discuss every day the wickedness of the swarthy Muslims, how they should all be sent back where they came from, how one can’t even walk down some streets without seeing a whole bunch of brown people doing their brown people things and how it’s not polite to say it but the Poles are really a set of bastards and the Palestinians deserve everything they get. And nothing happens.

Shrugging on my Chekist leather jacket for a moment, there are times when I’m inclined to feel that something should.

Late props go to alex who sums up the Argument We’re All Too Scared To Make adroitly:

Who exactly are the people who need “consulting” on immigration?
Are we talking about all UK residents of all backgrounds or are we really talking about white “indigenous” people?

Well alex it’s not PC to say this but that is exactly what they are saying. Maybe the Palestinians could have a similar debate on the immigration problem there…;) israelinurse, care to comment?

Don’t keep me in suspense, HPites

Oooo, look here!

I would like to make a few bets here. Comment box pundits will go for:

1. How dare he meet those genocidal Nazi bastards! He must hate all Jews! What’s his take on Hitler? Probably has a wank in front of the Fuhrer’s picture every day while chanting “Fuck the Yids”!

2. …there will be no 2, all commentators plumping unanimously for 1. With the exception of the few, the proud, the sane, who will make cautious remarks like “but we do need to talk to them at some point” and “this isn’t the same as unqualified admiration of rocket attacks, y’know.”

You’re a wee bit predictable, darlings.

That said, I was intrigued enough to Google this bloke. He’s Labour of a boringly moderate variety, advocates strong curbs on immigration and was once a  spad on of all fantastic things, cricket.

….this news just in, result! unseen sez

The fact that he is facing an electoral challenge from Salma Yaqoub in a 35% muslim constituency next election is doubtless coincidental.

Indeed it is, unseen! Mostly because he went as part of a Parliamentary group. Salma is a woman of many talents with damn fine taste in headgear, but not even she could clone herself to stand in that many seats.

If Mr Godsiff is the bad guy because he led a delegation, are all the rest collaborators? I demand an immediate investigation into their backgrounds at once.

(Also, how would this work? “Um, quite a lot of you are Muslims. I know there’s an acshul Muslim standing against me, but I once met some blokes from Hamas, does that count? And I really like halal kebabs after a pint or sev…er, I’ll get me coat.”)

I believe it’s possible to have a sincere interest in Middle East politics and be prepared to meet people from both sides of the argument in order to gain a greater understanding of the issues. But then I’m a wacky leftie, so I would.

HP’s Greatest Hits #2 – These Charming Men

This is a seriously old one, but it lulzy yo.

I bring it to show that I have positive and cheerful feelings towards HP now and again. This thread made me laugh from beginning to end. The idea is…who would you shag? (note no option for “would be shagged by”!)

Richard Seymour (lenin of Lenin’s Tomb) 

well?

 or Oliver Kamm

or him?

I leave it up to anyone who may stumble across this blog to choose between slightly overweight SWP member and disturbing intensity man. Unlike the estimable graham I do not advocate an all male threesome and would in fact like to scrub those images from my head when it comes to those two participants.

Mr Seymour has a talent – he can convert any situation into a discussion of being done up the bum sans lube, or including lube of a peculiarly horrible kind. I deduce from this that he’s more adventurous than the norm. Um. This may not always be a good thing.

Mr Kamm has a face which suggests “I know you’re going to get it on with me, the question is when”.  Nothing is so tedious!

So I guess I’m a nonparticipant! The HP thread is cute though. Scroll for pics and see if morgoth isn’t exactly as you imagined him.

HP’s Greatest Hits #1 – The Quakers Are Bastards!

Yes, here it is! The post which made my Watching fingers twitch (yeah I know it was ages ago. I’ve been busy, alright.)

Shorter: Some Quakers let the Stop the War Coalition hold a meeting at the Friends Meeting House. The Stop the War Coalition includes John Rees of the SWP, who HPers really hate for some reason, and some dodgy Muslim blokes. Also, they had two Hezbollah speakers.

Now, if you’re like me, you know fuck all about the Quakers, but do know that they’re pacifists. So I imagine something like this happened.

Dave (or it might be Sophie, or it might be Mohammed, or it might be Joolz) of the STWC: “Hello Quakers. We would like to use a large room for a meeting of the Stop the War Coalition. Would that be OK?”

Quaker: [*thinks…hmm stopping wars, good thing….*] “Gosh yes, no problem. Usual rules apply, no dogs unless they’re guide dogs, ummm pick up any litter after yourselves, let us know if you want to borrow the big projector.”

STWC: “Oh thanks, that’s great.”

STWC proceed to use room, Cde Rees speaks, a jolly good time is had by all (weeeeelllll) and then they all go to their respective homes and/or the pub, depending on relative levels of Islamicism.

Now depending on your view of the STWC and Hezbollah you might view this meeting as either a good thing or a bad thing. HP beat you all though. Because what they decided was that it meant that the Quakers’ guiding principle is “Fuck the Yids” and that they are “passive aggressive cunts.”

I cannot explain this in any way, shape or form. I’ve tried, I really have. But I don’t know how HP and David T got from A to Gamma Delivery Point 1.274. If I did understand it, I’d be on track to unravel the secrets of the universe, I reckon.

Their arguments:

1. The Quakers should have known that STWC was an utterly evil organisation and that John Rees and the SWP supported armed resistance. And that they were inviting naughty Muslim speakers to do their evil Muslim thing.

My response: But how the fuck now? I don’t know where or how David T lives but my daily life (work, pub, pub, work, pub, Co-op for more bread) is strangely uncluttered by people denouncing the STWC as evil supporters of genocidal fascism and telling me that Cde Rees supports the armed resistance in Iraq. In fact I would say that has never happened to me ever. The only reason I know who he is is that I’m politically active.  I venture to suggest I could go into any major city in the UK, stop 20 people and none of them would be aware of his views.

Also, dudes, you ever been involved in booking rooms? I have, and let me tell you we do not inquire in detail about who’s speaking and what they are going to say. The boundary is “hmm they sound acceptable, we’ll go with that.” In depth analysis would mean you never got anything done.

2. Pacifists are cunts who want someone else to do the heavy lifting for them and what’s more, probably hate Jews.

My response: A case can be made for the first (outside the scope of this blog) but the second wtf seriously.

3.  WHY AREN’T THE QUAKERS TELLING THE LEBANESE AND THE PALESTINIANS TO PACK IT IN

My response: Umm, if you don’t get this you don’t get politics. One fights the battle where one is. One holds one’s own government to account. The reason for this is that other governments are not persuadable and your government sometimes is. The wrongs of your government in international policy are committed in your name, therefore you have a vested interest in getting them to stop doing wrongs.

So presumably we should export a whole load of British Quakers to Lebanon/Gaza and get them to randomly wander around saying “I say chaps, well it’s really not cricket.” While simultaneously saying to the IDF “Jolly good show, carry on!”

Is it me, or has HP not got the whole “pacifism” thing?

There were a handful of sane commentators, but they were soon overwhelmed by the lava of madness. As per on HP.